FAQ: I like to type drunk. Who's responsible?

topic posted Sat, January 10, 2009 - 1:26 AM by  TOU (Terms o...
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Users are solely responsible for their content and bear all legal liability thereto, as stated in the TOU. This covers all criminal, moral, and personal responsibility. Any issue anyone has with content on Tribe is between the user and poster directly and Tribe has no responsibility nor exercises any editorial control. We provide the service as closely as we can to the principles of common carriage.
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  • Re: FAQ: I like to type drunk. Who's responsible?

    Sat, January 10, 2009 - 2:09 AM
    I like the way you drink.
    • Re: FAQ: I like to type drunk. Who's responsible?

      Sat, January 10, 2009 - 8:41 AM
      Users are solely responsible for their content and bear all legal liability thereto, as stated in the TOU.
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      sadly or wisely, depending on how you think about it, the laws of the usa don't allow tribe to erase all of its culpability via contract.
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      This covers all criminal, moral, and personal responsibility.
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      No, it doesn't, who'd you get to lawyer you, somebody you found trolling on tribe? Satan, perhaps?
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      Any issue anyone has with content on Tribe is between the user and poster directly and Tribe has no responsibility nor exercises any editorial control.
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      Which still does not alleviate culpability in abuser or stalker cases.
      You seem to think you wave a magick wand over a piece of paper and all liability goes away.
      It doesn't, and you aren't going to fool anybody but suckers like that.
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      We provide the service as closely as we can to the principles of common carriage.
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      Oh please. You are a bunch of lazy ethical half wits who do nothing but try to evade your responsibilities on any issue with ethical or moral implications. That does not even vaguely look like common carriage, and in any case, those laws barely apply here.

      keep talking orwellian as long as you like, ban me or toss me out on my ear, but you need somebody to slap you straight and get the silly and stupid out.

      Your responsibility does not go away just because you write in the contract that it does.


      • Re: FAQ: I like to type drunk. Who's responsible?

        Mon, January 12, 2009 - 4:58 PM
        Let's steer this one away from the abusiveness for a second and talk facts.

        How have the lawsuits against Facebook and MySpace fared? They say the same things in their contracts, and they have been sued, yeah?

        Seems to me prudence is best established by precedent, so what's the precedent, senor big brain?
        • Re: FAQ: I like to type drunk. Who's responsible?

          Tue, January 13, 2009 - 5:37 AM
          there are numerous precedents all of them very recent. Several people have now gone to jail or prison over internet stalking, and several minor sites have been shut down, at least temporarily.

          The simple fact of the matter is that the law recognizes tribes rights on the one hand to do what it is doing up to a point- but past that point into the red line tribe rapidly becomes culpable and could be sued, could be taken off line, or the staff could even go to prison for aiding and abetting or providing material support or etc.

          The first premise of ttribes policy is that they are not accountable and that thus nobody can force them to do the right thing.

          Both are false assumptions based on over simplified readings of the law.


          Tribe is accountable and responsible, and the smart thing to do would be to create a system to solve problems before they mushroom into much worse problems.

          Giving a green light to trolls as they now have only ensures over the long term that people will become more and more abusive because they learn that they can get away with it.

          Until that one time when it goes too far AND the victim has the time and money to take it to court.

          Then, tribe looses its ass. It could loose everything, literally, esp if it was found in court what we here already know;
          tribe has not fullfilled its obligations to call he police in instances of stalking, it has blamed victims, it has hidden and supported
          abusers, it has to be blunt already in theory done more than enough to end itself, should any of several people whom tribe does nknow to be abusive end up in a new legal battle, tribe could be held acountable for letting those people back on and etc... up to and including tribe staff spending time in prison, depending on how bad things got.
          • Unsu...
             

            Re: FAQ: I like to type drunk. Who's responsible?

            Tue, January 13, 2009 - 8:00 AM
            "there are numerous precedents all of them very recent. Several people have now gone to jail or prison over internet stalking, and several minor sites have been shut down, at least temporarily. "


            ---actually, these are very exceptional and extraordinary cases. Nothing that Prom complains about will ever be an exceptional or extraordinary case. He floods tribes with 8,000 word posts about his 180 IQ score, his superior genetic seed that he must use to impregnate dozens of women in pony play group sex scenes in order to save the world from itself, and his designs for a new order and a space ship to transport his chosen few away. That people laugh and ridicule him in response is hardly a matter for law enforcement. Well, at least not on this planet. Maybe on his spaceship, things will be different.
            • Re: FAQ: I like to type drunk. Who's responsible?

              Tue, January 13, 2009 - 11:09 PM

              ---actually, these are very exceptional and extraordinary cases.
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              allthough again, such cases become more common the more troll friendly a site is.
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              Nothing that Prom complains about will ever be an exceptional or extraordinary case.
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              Not that you'd know what i was talking about or what i am advocating, considering your characterization of me
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              He floods tribes with 8,000 word posts about his 180 IQ score,
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              I only bring that up after people attack me with the "you r stupid" brand of ad hominems.
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              his superior genetic seed that he must use to impregnate dozens of women in pony play group sex scenes
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              You are now making bullshit up out of your ass. I have never posted anything on any tribe like that. I am a member of some out there tribes
              and have reflected some interests in conversations with others, but i'm looking at human civilization as a whole through a petri dish,
              you have nothing on me other than what you think is an easy cheap shot.

              Instead, all you are doing is proving how desperately you are reaching and what an evil bastard you can be to struggle to knock somebody down, and how you think that kind of thing is okay and etc.

              I mean, competition is not the only survival trait there bruno, you can quit boxing with your halucinations.
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              in order to save the world from itself,
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              You got that part right.
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              and his designs for a new order and a space ship to transport his chosen few away.
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              No chosen few, i'm into open source direct democracy which means that my plan makes space accessible for everyone.
              Again, you know so little about me that your attack is proven defective in that you are clearly painting a cartoon which does not even resemble me.
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              That people laugh and ridicule him in response is hardly a matter for law enforcement.
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              Actually, people laughing and ridiculing is one thing, abuse is another. When you LIE in an attempt to SLANDER, that could become a legal matter, because you knowingly operated in contravention to the truth. So you may wish to think about how good of an example you wish to provide this discussion, because by going over the top theres a point at which you are actually proving my point.
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              Well, at least not on this planet. Maybe on his spaceship, things will be different.
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              on space ships society will have to be equisitely balanced just like the eco systems.

              closed systems and smaller systems mean less room for entropy.

              Tribe is in many senses a closed system and a small system and so the entropy gets obvious quick.

              For instance, you don't have an argument. But you do have some third rate ad hominems you picked up from satan.
              So entropy says that you will choose to run the system down and enhance entropy by attacking me personally,
              rather than address the issues or the problems.

              Eventually i win because either the entropy is addressed or it destroys the system.

              I'm right, i'm on topic and on target, and i am providing an information service where its needed.
              • Re: FAQ: I like to type drunk. Who's responsible?

                Wed, January 14, 2009 - 9:13 AM
                "and Tribe has no responsibility"

                en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culpability

                Culpability descends from the Latin concept of fault (culpa), which is still found today in the phrase mea culpa (literally, "my own fault"). The concept of culpability is intimately tied up with notions of agency, freedom and free will. All are commonly held to be necessary, but not sufficient, conditions for culpability.

                In explanations and predictions of human action and inaction culpability is a measure of the degree to which an agent, such as a person, can be held morally or legally responsible. Culpability marks the dividing line between moral evil, like murder, for which someone may be held responsible and natural evil, like earthquakes, for which no one can be held responsible.

                [edit] At law

                From a legal perspective, culpability describes the degree of one's blameworthiness in the commission of a crime or offense. Except for strict liability crimes, the type and severity of punishment often follow the degree of culpability.

                Modern crimes codes in the United States usually make distinct four degrees of culpability.

                Legal definitions are:

                1. A person acts intentionally with respect to a material element of an offence when:
                1. if the element involves the nature of his conduct or a result thereof, it is his conscious object to engage in conduct of that nature or to cause such a result; and
                2. if the element involves the attendant circumstances, he is aware of the existence of such circumstances or he believes or hopes that they exist.
                2. A person acts knowingly with respect to a material element of an offense when:
                1. if the element involves the nature of his conduct or the attendant circumstances, he is aware that his conduct is of that nature or that such circumstances exist; and
                2. if the element involves a result of his conduct, he is aware that it is practically certain that his conduct will cause such a result.
                3. A person acts recklessly with respect to a material element of an offense when he consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that the material element exists or will result from his conduct. The risk must be of such a nature and degree that, considering the nature and intent of the actor's conduct and the circumstances known to him, its disregard involves a gross deviation from the standard of conduct that a reasonable person would observe in the actor's situation.
                4. A person acts negligently with respect to a material element of an offense when he should be aware of a substantial and unjustifiable risk that the material element exists or will result from his conduct. The risk must be of such a nature and degree that the actor's failure to perceive it, considering the nature and intent of his conduct and the circumstances known to him, involves a gross deviation from the standard of care that a reasonable person would observe in the actor's situation.

                (The above has been quoted verbatim from the Pennsylvania Crimes Code. That in turn derives from the American Law Institute's Model Penal Code, which is the basis for large portions of the criminal codes in most states. The only difference is that the MPC uses "purposely" instead of "intentionally".)

                In short:

                * A person causes a result purposely/intentionally if the result is his/her goal in doing the action that causes it,
                * A person causes a result knowingly if he/she knows that the result is virtually certain to occur from the action he/she undertakes,
                * A person causes a result recklessly if he/she is aware of and disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk of the result occurring from the action, and
                * A person causes a result negligently if there is a substantial and unjustifiable risk he/she is unaware of but very much should be aware of.

                The first two types of culpability are each a subset of the following. Thus if someone acts purposely, they also act knowingly. If someone acts knowingly, they also act recklessly.

                The definitions of specific crimes refer to these degrees to establish the necessary mens rea (mental state) necessary for a person to be guilty of a crime. The stricter the culpability requirements, the harder it is for the prosecution to prove its case.

                For instance, the definition of first degree murder (again in PA) is "A criminal homicide constitutes murder of the first degree when it is committed by an intentional killing." Thus to be guilty of murder in the first degree, one must have an explicit goal in one's mind to cause the death of another. On the other hand, reckless endangerment has a much broader requirement: "A person commits a misdemeanor of the second degree if he recklessly engages in conduct which places or may place another person in danger of death or serious bodily injury." Thus to be guilty of this one only needs to be aware of a substantial risk he is putting others in danger of; it does not have to be one's explicit goal to put people in risk. (But, if one's goal is to put others in substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury, this is, of course, sufficient.)

                There is one more type of culpability, and that is strict liability. In strict liability crimes, the actor is responsible no matter what his mental state; if the result occurs, the actor is liable. An example is the felony murder rule: if the prosecution proves beyond reasonable doubt that one commits a qualifying felony (see the article) during which death results, one is held strictly liable for murder and the prosecution does not have to prove any of the normal culpability requirements for murder.